From http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=105934.200
Let's recount, i never said a word about a Limit, regardless - Lincoln increased spending by 300% into productive infrastructureI never said a word about anything to do with a 1980 Gold Price.. (perhaps you are looking at another persons quote again)I said McKinley advocated a Gold Standard (And he advocated using Lincolns policies, as you highlighted partially with the Tariffs and building railways)I addressed the Panama Canal, which was not infrastructure on or for the United States but an act of Britsh backed imperialism.And privately funded railroads? where is this coming from? yea they exist - have you seen any MODERN RAILROADS LATELY? ..... how about ANY OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE?.Let's see who is wrong, you compared Abraham Lincoln to Teddy Roosevelt - two complete opposites that had nothing to do with each other (Roosevelt was a traitor, Lincoln actually saved the Union from collapsing) , and then you say Teddy Roosevelt was a Greenbacker because he expanded the monetary supply in 1907?... this means, what?. Because he expanded the monetary supply by issueing Greenbacks there still wasn't a Gold Standard (It was SUSPENDED TEMPORARILY).
Who is lying? huh?. who links to a blog for information about Presidents?. Have you even responded to 75% of the things i've written (instead of cherry picking what you could point and say "Ad Hominem" aka "You are a liar i have no counter argument from the Austrian school), or the video you said you didn't watch or ..... maybe i should just stop, you aren't really worth wasting time blathering about diversions, "Teddy Roosevelt was a Lincoln Nationalist" is that a joke?. Actually McKinley's policy was "We are going to fight through the Gold Standard" meaning, we are going to BUILD THINGS. So, infact 90% of the history you posted was nonsense including your pathetic attempt at attacking Stephen Zarlenga as opposed to actually debunking his refute, which (If anyone read it : http://monetary.org/refute.htm) they would see that Mengers theory makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.So go ahead, ad hominem, and populem, ad nauseum , strawman this to death.
Oh heavens, i am still ALSO waiting for the explanation to how the OUTSTANDING DEBT is going to magically correct when the monetary supply contracts.... i almost forgot about one of the major reasons a Gold Standard would cause genocide..........What happened to that?, wasn't on your cherry picking list like the video i used to highlight what i am talking about?.
-Revolt 426
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=12517
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What caused that Depression? a reversal of Lincoln's policy of spending currency into productive infrastructure. And no, we've not been bankrupt (until mid 2007) since 1933. Even Ron Paul admits this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wz7yBRihxSM
While McKinley may have advocated a Gold Standard, there is no doubt he was a Lincoln Nationalist - he wanted to build a railway to South America (Or Ibero America), Teddy Roosevelt came in and reversed that ideal and added a lot of kookery (In other regards , not economics).
I forgot about War Plan Red, (Although i concede it has nothing to do with economics).... This also occured after McKinley was killed, and we do know Lord Palmerston of Britain was responsible for the Confederacy seceeding..... War Plan Red actually led to Pearl Harbor. So we have Lincoln, 100% enemy of Britain, and Teddy Roosevelt 100% ALLY of Britain.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red.
.....War Plan Red was created because Americans knew Britain was locked in a strategic alliance with Japan, the Anglo-Japanese Alliance of 1902. American planners thought that Britain’s imperial reach would bring it into conflict with the US. In 1935 War Plan Red was updated and specified which roads to use in the invasion. "The best practicable route to Vancouver is via Route 99" (Carlson, 2005). Further, in 1935 Americans planned to build three military airfields near the Canadian border and disguise them as civilian airports. "In February 1935, the War Department arranged a Congressional appropriation of $57 million dollars to build three border air bases for the purposes of pre-emptive surprise attacks on Canadian air fields" (Berlin Glasnost, 1992-2007). The airfields were to be kept secret but their existence were accidentally published on the front page of the New York Times on May 1, 1935.
Had James A Garfield AND McKinley (Who wanted to build railways to South America, and was a Lincoln nationalist greenbacker Republican) NOT been assassinated, that would not have even been a Depression, and McKinley's was succeeded by Teddy Roosevelt (Whom was the cousin of a British Intelligence officer) that re-instutued the Gold Standard (The opposite of what McKinley wanted) - however i am glad you brought this point up....
Since we have proven the privatized issuence of currency inevitably leads to chaos, you've actually highlighted the whole point in the Government issuence of currency, which is people have FAR MORE control over it than say, the Federal Reserve?.....
When an entity that issues currency can BYPASS Congressional appropriations, Executive signing and Treasury issuence of credit........ this leads to Weimar Germany, and Hitler. History repeats itself, it is good to not make the same mistakes over and over again.
-Revolt 426
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By the way, for those that do not understand, the Federal Reserve is not a Bank, it is a Banking System (A parasitical one) therefor, putting the system into bankruptcy.
Do you think we can tell China "We aren't paying our debt, screw you" and avoid a war?. We are dealing with a Global Collapse of the entire world monetary system and we have the same clowns with the same non existent arguments .....
Bankruptcy Reorganization is the only Constitutional way to destroy all derivatives (You know, the 1.5 Quadrillion $ Worth that is destroying the entire planet) , once the FED system is ridded of the Derivative mess, you can go ahead and Nationalize it into the Treasury department and have a sovereign currency...
Ammended * It is also under bankruptcy judge supervision
-Revolt 426
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By the way, it is noteworthy to mention Lincoln did the exact opposite in regards to foreign relations , and Teddy Roosevelt had British Traitors all over his immediate family.
Actually, without Lincoln allying with the Czar of Russia, the Civil War would have destroyed the United States.
Teddy Roosevelt was put in to destroy relations with certain countries to pave the way for WWI
If you read any of the posts in this thead, you would know that there is indeed a sound alternative to the Austrian method and the status quo, you just choose to ignore it... which is unfortunate but atleast you acknowledge the resultant would be an incalculable amount of foreclosers and debt defaults of various kinds.
With a greenback system you are able to
A) issue currency without a CAP into productive means which does not cause inflation. (What causes inflation is when you allow the printing of currency into UN-Productive means and the Net Production levels fall below the monetary supply)
B) There will have to be a Government Intervention to keep people in their homes regardless of any reform because this is the greatest economic collapse in the history of man kind due to it's globalized unique nature and massive population levels to sustain.
C) Rebuild the Nations infrastructure which is the only thing that would allow a recovery in the first place.
-Revolt 426
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The problem is that "fiscal stimulus" usually means borrowing the money in question before "spending" it. This borrowing aspect is the literal opposite of what I'm proposing:
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http://www.wealthmoney.org/happen.html
What Would Happen?If the American Transportation Act were passed and became effective January 1, 2006, you would no longer pay tax on gasoline, diesel or other fuels. You would pay no tax on oil products, no tollway fees, no axle taxes, license fees, or other taxes normally collected to pay for roads and bridges. Taxes to build and maintain roads and bridges would no longer be collected. No more bonding would be necessary for road & bridge construction and maintenance. Property taxes would be lower. All new money would now be created and exchanged into circulation as a Wealth (debt-free) payment for the labor and raw resources used in combination to build and maintain our roads and bridges. These are a Wealth produced that benefit ALL citizens equally. This was the principle behind the 'monetizing' of gold and silver bullion Free as a Wealth to the people who produced it and a debt-free medium of exchange to ALL. The government would hold the roads and bridges in "trust" for the people who would thereafter use them free-of-charge with no taxation or fees of any kind. The new money would represent the Wealth of our Nation (peoples' labor and raw sources) just like gold certificates once represented the Wealth metal money produced by the people and deposited with the Treasury. The certificate represented the production and was as good as the Wealth (gold or silver) it represented.
[Continued...]----------------------------------There's a fundamental difference between monetizing debt (as Keynesian borrow-and-spenders would have us do) and monetizing wealth.
Economic Reform?If they are not spent productively you get an economic breakdown like we are currently seeing, this can lead to inflation.The point of spending them into productivity is that productivity (Labor) is required for Capitalism to exist.Our current workforce is a "Service Economy" meaning, there is virtually no production left due to outsourcing to slave wage nations via "Free Trade" agreements.....You cannot subsitute production with services, because it leads to the current situation. I hope that answers the question.
-Revolt 426
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http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=105934.320
only in dreamland, can you prosecute people for fraud after they collapse the entire economic system. My argument "Hinges" on what U.S. History has shown us, your argument has no historical base whatsoever. The delusional fantasy that "the threat of proseuction" Is going to stop a sociopath from creating a situation like this is histerical.. only certain regulations (Like the regulation that prohibited banks from speculating with deposit money that you oppose) would stop the actual collapse. You would prefer to wait for the collapse, and then prosecute them after the entire economy is wiped out. And since i know there is someone in the thread that is going to equate what i just said to "thought crimes" , firstly i never said all regulation was good - secondly, Derivatives being private, off the book contracts is the REASON why this has occured... if there was a regulation on financial speculations, this could not possibly have occured.
Congress had quite a difficult time getting a bailout bill through (IT failed the first time) for 750 Billion dollars after they were lied to by Bernanke who said the entire planet would meltdown in 24 hours and we would have martial law (This would not happen without the FED)........ the remainder of bailout money has actually been issued by BYPASSING Congress, and if you don't understand that 13 Trillion is ALOT more then 750 Billion, then you should go do some math homework. If you recall, the first bailout vote had so many phone calls opposing it that it failed...........
And last i checked, Ron Paul's audit the fed bill has 190 co-sponsers? are they all evil?.
Just another argument made without thinking......... They should be prosecuted as fraud AND REGULATED to prevent this situation from occuring AGAIN.
-Revolt 426
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