More Economic News in March of 2010

Quote from: Revolt426 on April 21, 2009, 08:01:51 PM

letting the system collapse will destroy everything

Including millions and millions of lives. But then cults are known for their eery fondness of human sacrifice, so perhaps that's to be expected.

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a gold standard would cause the worse deflation in the history of humanity

And would thus force countless millions of Americans out of job and home, and would make millions more virtual slaves to their creditors, since it would likely take the average wage-earner several decades just to pay off a $5,000 credit card debt, and several lifetimes to pay off a mortgage. (This, of course, is what William Jennings Bryan was referring to when he talked about mankind being crucified upon a "cross of gold.")

To call that "freedom" is no less Orwellian and no less ridiculous than saying that "war is peace" or that "ignorance is knowledge."

To any relative newcomers who may be reading this: to have a better understanding of why the "gold standard" is not the panacea that Austrian Schoolers blindly insist it is, see the following:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9E0UPBtmTb0 (part 1 of 3)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9FWECWWN5o (part 2 of 3)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aM7D3mnUSI0 (part 3 of 3)



-geolibertarian


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No, you should go do some research on the British Empire and the Rothschild gold reserves though. If you think Gold can facilitate an ever growing population of now 6.8 Billion , and if we actually had freedom, it would grow even further. Suppose the worlds Gold Supply runs out? Shall we all just stop developing the economy and die?.

Tell me, what happens when the population goes from 7 Billion to 10 Billion and there isn't enough Gold? what do we do?.....

Money is a MEANS OF EXCHANGE that REPRESENTS IT'S UNDERLYING ECONOMY. There is NO REASON TO PUT A CAP ON IT when POPULATION IS EXPANDING.

The Gold standard contributed VERY much to bankrupting the Nation and PREVENTING it from rebuilding itself , It STRANGLED the nation for CURRENCY because the BRITISH CONTROLLED THE GOLD SUPPLIES.

If you cannot understand this, then you are doomed and i thank god that someone like you is not in power.

The Panic if 1837 was caused by the GOLD STANDARD resulting in massive DEFLATION and paving the way for the CIVIL WAR.

-Revolt 246

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*sigh*

That, for the umpteenth time, is because it's not "our" government at the moment (due to institutionalized election-rigging), and why election reform must therefore be implemented simultaneously.

How many more times must I explain this to you? A dozen? Two dozen?

-geolibertarian

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As usual you've got it backwards.

Milton Friedman (for those who don't already know) was awarded the Nobel Prize in economics largely for his scholarly achievements in the field of monetary history and theory. And it was he -- after already having won said prize -- who wrote the following:

"Inflation occurs when the quantity of money rises appreciably more rapidly than [economic] output, and the more rapid the rise in the quantity of money per unit of output, the greater the rate of inflation. There is probably no other proposition in economics that is as well established as this one." (Free to Choose, p. 254)

It is therefore the Austrian School, not its critics, that is mindlessly denying "reality" when it blindly insists that printing new money is automatically inflationary even if the resultant increase in the money supply does not exceed the increase in economic output.

On issue after issue, Austrian Schoolers try desperately to mold reality so that it conforms to their half-baked theories instead of the other way around, and then, in their usual arrogant fashion, hypocritically project this irrational tendency onto any informed critic who dares to call them on it.

Another illustration of this is their dogmatic view of government "intervention" in the marketplace. If one is to avoid being charged with heresy by self-appointed Thought Police from the Austrian School, it is simply not enough to say that "most" government regulations are bad or unnecessary. No, no, one must openly believe with utter conviction that all government regulations are bad and evil by definition.

Nowhere is this blind devotion to ideological dogma more evident than in the case of derivatives. As most listeners of Alex's show have probably figured out by now, the financial meltdown of 2008/2009 had far more to do with the quadrillion-dollar derivatives bubble than it did with the comparatively miniscule subprime mortgage bubble. Yet, in the articles they write concerning the financial crisis, Austrian School commentators rarely (if ever) even mention the word derivatives, let alone acknowledge the primary causative role they played.

Why?

To me the answer is rather obvious: because doing so would draw unwanted attention to the fact that Wall Street casino gamblers could never have created the derivatives bubble in the first place had the Glass-Steagall Act -- a form of (gasp!) "government intervention" -- not been repealed in 1999. And since Austrian Schoolers have so much of their precious egos invested in the baseless presumption that all government regulations are bad (not just "most"), it's impossible for them to admit that the repeal of a particular regulation could possibly have caused far more harm than good, even when the facts overwhelmingly show that it did.

This, I'm now convinced, is why Austrian School reactionaries scoff even at the idea of election reform: because they've allowed themselves to be brainwashed (as cult members are prone to do) into believing that a total collapse of our entire economy -- and hence of society itself! -- is not only inevitable, but desirable; and that anything that gets in the way of this collapse is therefore a bad thing, not a good thing.

Why?

Simple. Because, just as socialists perceive "the State" as a mystical, God-like entity existing independently of the people who compose it, Austrian Schoolers have a similar conception of the "free market," as evidenced by this quasi-religious notion they incessantly promote that, following said collapse, a mystical, God-like entity euphemistically known as the "free market" will magically rise like a phoenix from the ashes of our destroyed nation, give birth to a gold-based money system, and all will be well with the world.

The NWO promotes "order" out of chaos; the Austrian School promotes economic revival and stability out of chaos. Either way you're dealing with a glorified cult that tries to sell people on the insane idea that "chaos" is a legitimate and effective means of achieving a desirable socioeconomic goal.

It is for this reason that I respectfully call once again on all thinking members of the anti-NWO/pro-America movement to stop allowing Austrian School cultists portray themselves as the divine gatekeepers of any and all things having to do with "liberty," "property" and "free enterprise."

Just as we must defend America from those who would destroy it in the name of the NWO, we must defend it against those who would -- by deliberate omission, and in the name of the "free market" -- knowingly allow America to be destroyed by an otherwise solvable economic and political crisis.

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Yeah, it's just soooo absurd to value people more than a piece of metal, isn't it?

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"[Andrew] Jackson and Van Buren removed the monetary power from the private bankers but did not re-establish it in the hands of the nation. Instead, Van Buren organized the Independent Treasury System, establishing 15 sub branches of the Treasury to handle government moneys in 1840. From December 1836 the government moved toward making and receiving all payments in coinage, or truly convertible bank notes....Once the state bank notes were no longer accepted by the government, their circulation was cut back dramatically.

"This was the closest our nation has ever come to implementing a real gold/silver standard. Operating under the commodity theory of money, Van Buren, who truly cared for the Republic, helped bring on the worst depression the Nation had ever seen, starting in 1837. It was reportedly even worse than that caused by the 2nd Bank of the U.S. in 1819. Bad as the state bank notes were, they had still been functioning as money!

"Those who proclaim that no gold and silver money system has ever failed should consider that whether you are a laborer, farmer, or industrialist, the money system's success or failure is not measured by the value of a piece of metal. When your job, your farm, or factory has disappeared in a monetarily created depression, the system has failed!" [Emphasis mine]

-- Stephen Zarlenga, The Lost Science of Money, p. 426


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Austrian School cultists just never stop. The moment they find out someone has created a thread devoted to explaining to people that, contrary to Austrian School dogma, it's not necessary to destroy our economy (by letting criminal bankers foreclose on everyone and then euphemistically calling this parasitic wealth-transfer a market-based "correction" instead of a fraud-based looting) in order to save it; that it's not necessary to burn down our economic "house" in order to roast the inflationary "pig"; and that crucifying mankind upon a cross of gold is not the only alternative to enslaving mankind within a prison of debt, they immediately flock to that thread like obsessed stalkers and begin trolling and trolling and trolling, ad nauseam, in a desperate attempt to derail that thread, and to discourage relative newcomers from learning more about the "Greenback" alternative.

If, after all the facts and information that've been presented in this and other threads, someone is still foolish enough to take these discredited trolls seriously, then that someone quite probably deserves to live in aristocratic tyranny (which is exactly what the let-everything-collapse/cross-of-gold approach of the Austrian School would quickly lead to).

-geolibertarian

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Austrian Theory maintains monetary supplies do not matter, as all prices will magically adjust to their relative deflated price due to the mythical invisible hand theory - the problem with that is - if you owe any DEBT , specifically perhaps, a MORTGAGE....... This means it will be impossible to pay the inflated bubble denominated debt value with deflated dollars. The fact of the matter is, any Gold Standard would due exactly this, put everyone with even the slightest excess debt will be put into bankruptcy - followed by making anyone with smaller debts from (installment loans, credit card debt, auto laons, school loans) slaves to their creditors for the rest of their lives.

So the fact remains, regardless of all the babble that the implimentation of a Gold Standard or any commodity standard that would not take monetary supply into account would
1) Kick millions of homeowners out of their homes via foreclosure by the very bankers who have just orchestrated what the Austrian school is saying we should not intervene with to allow the market to "correct" itself

2) make anyone with small debt (Possibly anywhere above a few thousand) a slave for decades.

And you will NEVER receieve a rational explanation from the Austrian school on this question as to the fact that there is not enough Gold to faciltitate 7 Billion human beings and the result of the Bankrupt U.S. returning to a Gold Standard would do the above mentioned horrors to the population , most of whom were tricked by private bankers (Who are now looting our entire economy) to take out loans when they could not afford them on during particular Greenspan bubbles.

Anyone who denies implimenting a Gold Standard would not cause deflation is flat out lying, and it would accellerate the entire collapse into freefall by kicking millions of labor force workers out of their homes and handing their houses to the banking empire that created this entire derivative bubble , infrastructure deficit economic COLLAPSE (Not a Depression, a DISINTIGRATION).

-Revolt426


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I don't exactly get your jist?. Are you saying if we managed to reform the system, there would still be wrecking deflation/unemployment? That is the point of informing people about monetary reform, so they know what they are demanding when they take back the system. The whole idea is based on the precondition that we CAN take back atleast OUR Government and prevent a collapse - the other idea, that others seem to think it's great to push is "We can't do anything, let the system come down"........... but.....

The problem with the idea that we are going to allow a system to "Collapse" which is exactly what not doing anything would do in this situation is, history shows us there will inevitably be Martial Law and/or a Coup De Tat that destroys the entire Republic......... This has occured virtually everytime a monetary system completely disintigrated in addition to massive unthinkable amounts of human suffering. So, you infact will probably get a situation 10 fold worse, aka Hitler.

So, regardless of the fact that a Gold System is not sound as has been highlighted numerous times on the board since it would have devestating effects on an economy during a Break Down Depression and strangle the nation for currency (As the above article sort of mentions what this does).

If you even sat back, and allowed a structural breakdown of the entire system you wouldn't only get Genocide, but a Coup De Tat / Martial Law / Death of your country.

So this fairy tailish notion that we can "Let the system collapse" and then "Replace it" after it has wrecked the entire Nation since we didn't intervene and let the whole thing come down is absurd on numerous fronts.....


-Revolt 426

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If you had half a brain cell, you would realize Alan Greenspan was ALWAYS BOUGHT and all you can do is post the same propagated nonsense over and over again because you think you can go ahead and use the CIA run Google Search Engine , MINDLESSLY advocating a monetary policy (Like some others in this forum - though i admit there are some people who do indeed know what Austrian's wish to do) when you haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about at all........ it's really pathetic this mindless copy/pasting that you do in all of your threads , taking every single thing you see for granted as the absolute truth with complete disregard for the FACT that propaganda has been spread ALL OVER the internet, and again disregarding the fact that your sources (If you ever have any, which you usually don't) are all corrupt sociopaths (Like Amity Shlaes of the Council on Foreign Relations / American Enterprise Institute and Alan Greenspan)........ then you go ahead and say of all people, Webster Tarpley, the first person to write a book exposing 9-11 as a False Flag, the first person to expose OBAMA as a tri-lateral puppet , is lying - and YOUR "GOOGLED' sources are accurate when in reality they are straight from the Council on Foreign Relations and other Rockefeller directed propaganda outlets.

In ADDITION to ALL OF THIS nonsense you repeatedly post without the slightest conception of what you are doing - you are associating what Tarpley "ADVOCATES" with GeoLibertarian when infact, Geo is an adovcate of HENRY GEORGE, and Tarpley is merely highlighting the monetary policy of Abraham Lincoln. So infact, this hasn't the SLIGHTEST thing to do with Tarpley (Though clowns in this forum who wish to again, MINDLESSLY , De-Rail threads LOVE to target him as if he invented the "Greenback" System that he advocates a return to).

It is unbelievable at this point in the game, that people like you (The only term to describe it is : MINDLESSLY) agreeing with re-written history and mis-associating monetary reform with a HISTORIAN from the 9-11 Truth Movement who is merely pointing out that the Gold Standard is NOT the answer and advocating the return to a "Credit" System as opposed to a Monetarist system where there is the delusion that "Currency has intrinsic value" and drives the economy as opposed to money being a means of exchange that reflects the nations producitve OUTPUT, which is what REALLY drives an economy.

The really sad part about this is, you are going to go ahead and post another 5 page re-written version of history in response to this, because you are obviously not capable of understanding what you are doing (Brainwashing people), though i admit - you are doing it unwittingly and i don't think you have malicious intentions, you still haven't the slightest concept of what you are actually pasting on the board in a multitude of threads.

It's just falling RIGHT into the trap they have set, which is associating Obama with "Marxist Socialism" when infact, he is pushing Corporatism (The BANKS run the Nation, not the Government) so in 4 years if this nation is still here after the well provided LEFT COVER you are giving him - they will impliment a FAR RIGHT WING policy when Obama is replaced, and let the entire system collapse resulting in the destruction of the United States due to the again, "MINDLESS" theory that if we sick back and let the system collapse a new "Gold System" will miraculously replace the post industrial wreckage of a so called "Productive Economy" without the Phsysical Infrastructure that actually DRIVES an economy's production capabilities being REBUILT....

DELUSIONS, and MORE DELUSIONS with no DEBATE comes from you. Since you are incapable of an actual debate, you resort to posting things other people write (And as i just mentioned, most of it is pure propagated history, with a bit of your own spin as well)



Yes, i ALREADY DID so by writing an ESSAY on it here : http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=105934.0

If you read this, you will see that you are calling BENJAMIN FRANKLIN and GEORGE WASHINGTON "Socialists"

And i agree with virtually everything GeoLibertarian says in this THREAD as well.............




NEWSFLASH! SOCIALISM: WHEN THE GOVERNMENT SEIZES THE MEANS OF PRODUCTION

NEWSFLASH! when you CALL OBAMA a Socialist, you give him LEFT COVER and people LIKE HIM MORE

hello! is anyone there Lord Edward? ANYONE?

You are interpreting the "General Welfare" Clause , as if you were a lawmaker? who do you think you are, GOD?

The whole point is, when you call CORPORATISM, SOCIALISM - you are providing OBAMA with COVER and you do it virtually EVERY DAY. This means all the liberals who are brainwashed by Obama see you as another right wing Rush Limbaugh CLOWN because they think Obama is actually re-distributing wealth, and providing everyone with Government assistance, when he is doing the OPPOSITE


But i am a "Socialist" because i advocate a monetary reform where the Government merely issues currency into productive infraststructure...... perhaps you should read the communist manifesto and educate yourself as to what "Socialism" is rather then calling every thing the Government does "Socialism" when we currently have FASCISM - and perhaps you should stop posting 5-10 page long American Liberty League (Rockefeller/Morgan/DuPont) and American Enterprise Institute (Rupert Murdoch) documents that have re-written history? I've caught you doing so numerous times but you of course, go ahead and do it again - then attack people from the 9-11 Truth movement as "Socialists".... It's just the epidamy of STUPIDITY to do these things and intentionally MISLEAD people.


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@Lord Edward Coke

Quote

In any event, by 1934, the one-dollar bill read:
This note is legal tender for all debts, public and private and
is redeemed in lawful money at the Treasury or at any Federal
Reserve Bank.
And in 1963, this wording had again changed to: "This note is legal
tender for all debts, public and private." This bill was no longer redeemable
in "lawful money" (gold and silver) SCHEME COMPLETE.

As for France you are merely making a case for me here, that the Private Sector can RIG bubbles! I don't even see what the argument is...... regardless....

First off , no one had advocated the FED here, at all. That seems to be a uniform agreement so posting nonsense about it is irrelivant. Other than the fact that you repeatedly ignore Article 1 Sec 8's authority "To borrow money from the credit of the Government" and to "To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures", which the Nation was FOUNDED upon (A Fiat Currency), you are for some reason critisizing FDR for taking the nation off the Gold Standard in 1933 as a "SCHEME" when if it didn't the entire Nation woud have collapsed. This is irrefutable, any Austrian will tell you it's the truth. The monetary supply had contracted 30% and the nation was bankrupt. This was the sitation and we had to be taken off the Gold Standard because it was wrecking our economy (Now i am noting in advance because we always have this problem.... we don't need flame baiting, we are not talking about the Austrian school in this instance, but history):

"My investigation convinced me that during the last quarter of a century the average production of gold has been falling off considerably. The gold mines of the world are practically exhausted. There is only about $11,000,000,000 in gold in the world, with the United States owning a little more than four billions. We have more than $100,000,000,000 in debts payable in gold of the present weight and fineness. . . As a practical proposition these contracts cannot be collected in gold for the obvious reason that the gold supply of the entire world is not sufficient to make payment."
-- Congressional Record, Congressman Dies, March 15, 1933.


Let's expand upon this since you are 100% ignoring the relevant factors here. It was IMPOSSIBLE for the economy to function at this point because we were bankrupt and could not fund any Government Expenditures (Roads, Bridges , even emergancy medical / bread lines).... WHY did this happen? England intentionally defaulted on Gold, this is ECONOMIC WARFARE and requires measures to prevent a Collapse of the United States!. As you can see there are a massive amount of factors you are omitting that even occured prior to Roosevet even being President!:

http://www.tarpley.net/29crash.htm
[b]BRITISH FINANCIAL WARFARE: 1929; 1931- 33[/b]

The ravaged post-war, post-Versailles world of the 1920's provides the main backdrop for the following considerations:

1. The events leading to the Great Depression are all related to British economic warfare against the rest of the world, which mainly took the form of the attempt to restore a London- centered world monetary system incorporating the gold standard. The efforts of the British oligarchy in this regard were carried out by a clique of international central bankers dominated by Lord Montagu Norman of the Bank of England, assisted by his tools Benjamin Strong of the New York Federal Reserve Bank and Hjalmar Schacht of the German Reichsbank. This British-controlled gold standard proved to be a straightjacket for world economic development, somewhat along the lines of the deflationary Maastricht "convergence criteria" of the late 1990's.

2. The New York stock exchange speculation of the Coolidge-Hoover era was not a spontaneous phenomenon, but was rather deliberately encouraged by Norman and Strong under the pretext of relieving pressure on the overvalued British pound sterling after its gold convertibility had been restored in 1925. In practice, the pro-speculation policies of the US Federal Reserve were promoted by Montagu Norman and his satellites for the express purpose of fomenting a Bubble Economy in the United States, just as later central bankers fostered a Bubble Economy in Japan after 1986. When this Wall Street Bubble had reached gargantuan proportions in the autumn of 1929, Montagu Norman sharply cut the British bank rate, repatriating British hot money, and pulling the rug out from under the Wall Street speculators, thus deliberately and consciously imploding the US markets. This caused a violent depression in the United States and some other countries, with the collapse of financial markets and the contraction of production and employment. In 1929, Norman engineered a collapse by puncturing the bubble.

3. This depression was rendered far more severe and, most importantly, permanent, by the British default on gold payment in September, 1931. This British default, including all details of its timing and modalities, and also the subsequent British gambit of competitive devaluations, were deliberate measures of economic warfare on the part of the Bank of England. British actions amounted to the deliberate destruction of the pound sterling system, which was the only world monetary system in existence at that time. The collapse of world trade became irreversible. With deliberate prompting from the British, currency blocs emerged, with the clear implication that currency blocs like the German Reichsmark and the Japanese yen would soon have to go to war to obtain the oil and other natural resources that orderly world trade could no longer provide. In 1931, Norman engineered a disintegration by detonating the gold backing of the pound sterling.

4. In the United States, the deliberate British default of September 1931 led, given the do-nothing Hoover Administration policies, directly to the banking crisis of 1932-33, which closed down or severely restricted virtually every bank in the country by the morning of Franklin D. Roosevelt's inauguration. If Roosevelt had not broken decisively with Hoover's impotent refusal to fight the depression, constitutional government might have collapsed. As it was, FDR was able to roll back the disintegration, but economic depression and mass unemployment were not overcome until 1940 and the passage of Lend-Lease...

......BRITISH DEFAULT: TEN MORE YEARS OF WORLD DEPRESSION
The Gibraltar of British Empire finance had crashed. The old saying, "as safe as the Bank of England" was now a mockery. "It was only vaguely understood, if at all, that at stake was what is called today the 'world monetary system.' It was still a sterling system. The likely alternative to...the gold standard, at the old sterling parity, may have been the breakdown of that system. That is what happened after September, 1931.' [Palyi, p. 86] "The cooperation of the central banks in the 1920's ended in a breakdown of the entire system, having been essentially a cloak that masked the ultimate purpose of its chief ingredient, the gold exchange standard, which was to maintain Britain's gold standard without obeying the rules of the gold standard." [p. 146]

During the 18-month period after the British default, most world currencies also terminated gold payments through external default. Until March, 1933 the US dollar and some of its satellite currencies in central America were able to keep up payments on gold. Otherwise, the gold standard was maintained by a group of countries called the "gold bloc," comprehending France, Holland, Belgium, Switzerland, Italy, Poland, and Estonia. Estonia was forced off gold, and Italy and Poland imposed gold export controls. The Belgian franc was devalued in March, 1935. France imposed a gold embargo in September, 1936. Switzerland and Holland announced devaluations immediately thereafter.

Of the fifty-four nations that had been on the gold standard at some timne between 1925 and 1931, none remained on gold in 1937. The world monetary system had indeed disintegrated. ......


.....BEYOND BREAKDOWN TO DISINTEGRATION
The year 1931 is thus a turning point in the financial history of Europe analogous to 1914 in political-military history: "...because of the profound influence of the war upon the structure of the world's credit system and upon the economic environment in which it operated, 1914-19 was a period that marked the breakdown, rather than the suspension or modification, of the pre-war international gold standard system.......when England suspended the convertibility of sterling in 1931 the international gold standard as a world institution entered into an historical phase which must be described by a stronger term than breakdown. SEPTEMBER 1931 MARKED THE BEGINNING OF ITS DISINTEGRATION." [Brown, p. 1052, emphasis added]

Current historians and economists are fixated on 1929, but there can be no doubt that September 1931 was the more important watershed by far. "Britain's devaluation in 1931 had a psychological and political impact on Europe, and beyond, that can hardly be overestimated. In final analysis, the break-up of the international financial and commercial system was a decisive factor in balkanizing Europe and preparing the ground for World War II." [Palyi, p. 270] Another writer noted that among the "consequences [of 1931] were an increase of international suspicion and hatred, an inflamed nationalism in Europe and, finally, war." [Giuseppi, p. 164] Indeed.



This is REALITY, you can't ignore it, you can rant and rave about FDR taking us off the Gold Standard all you want, if you were unemployed and in a hoover-ville back then and your nation was collapsing around you, and the only solution was to de-couple the dollar from Gold via declaring Federal Banktuptcy, you would not be complaining at all. Infact, back then, the majority of people who were on breadlines were demanding EXACTLY what Roosevelt did, yet you insist it was a "Scheme". Good lord, if he didn't take us off the Gold Standard in 1933 this country would have collapsed there is no doubt about it. The Gold Standard at that time was bad enough, but then the British intentionally defaulted on Gold and drove our export prices sky high so we couldn't even trade internationally!........ i can not for the life of me understand why you would advocate allowing the entire nation to collapse just to stay on a Gold Standard... it's IN-HUMANE plain and simple.

Furthermore, you are really neglecting to mention/understand how the institution of a Presidency works. Anyone that knows history, knows the best President's in U.S. History had Finance Oligarchs to deal with and certain things HAD to be compromised on otherwise the result would have been assassination. Would good is a President after he's assassinated?....... Guiseppe Zangara fired 5 shots at FDR prior to his inauguration and hit the mayor who was standing right next to him. You are going to tell me FDR was in on an assassination attempt that almost killed him, missing his head by a few feet?. Of course, after this, The Morgan Controlled American Liberty League recruited Retired General Smedly Butler to Overthrow him and install a Fascist Dictatorship. How can you even possibly assert Roosevelt was in on the attempt to overthrow his own administration, it's ludicrous!.

The primary thing Lincoln and FDR had in common as opposed to their fundamental policy of monetizing infrastructure is that they had to appoint enemies to their cabinet to manipulate them. This is a FACT, being a President is not being in control of the country. The Presidency of the United States is an institution of various departments in which each department has operating power outside control of the actual President. It is necessary to understand certain things are beyond a President's control in our world, which is exactly why Lincoln had to appoint a flaming liberal as his Treasury Sectretary amongst other enemies, and which is exactly why FDR did the same thing. All this FDR bashing , 95% of it is just baseless attacks via intentionally omitting and distorting very relevant hisotric facts, particularly the economic warfare waged against us by London, which of course PROVES currency and market manipulation are very relevant, and even further makes the case for a FIXED Exchange rate system.


THE BRITISH RECORD OF STARTING WALL STREET PANICS
The British had a long track record of using the London Bank Rate (that is, the rediscount rate of the Bank of England) for financial and economic warfare against the United States. The periodic panics of the nineteenth century were more often than not caused by deliberate British sabotage. A few examples:

* In the Panic of 1837, the stage had been set for depression by outgoing President Andrew Jackson's and Secretary of the Treasury Roger Taney's abolition of the Second Bank of the United States, by their cultivation of the state "pet" banks, by their imbecilic Specie Circular of 1836, which demanded gold payment to the federal government for the purchase of public lands, and by their improvident distribution of the Treasury surplus to the states. London's ultinmate weapon turned out to be the Bank of England bank rate. With all the American defenses sabotaged, the Bank of England sharply raised its discount rates, sucking gold specie and hot money liquidity back across the Atlantic, while British merchants and trading houses cut off their lines of credit to their American customers. In the resulting chaos, not just private banks and businesses went bankrupt, but also the states of Mississippi, Louisiana, Maryland, Pennsylvania, Indiana, and Michigan, which repudiated their debts, permanently impairing US credit in the world. Internal improvements came to a halt, and the drift towards secession and civil war became more pronounced.

* The Panic of 1873 resuted from a British-directed effort to ruin the banking house of Jay Cooke and Company, which had served Lincoln and his successors as a quasi-governmental agency for the marketing of United States Treasury securities and railroad bonds during and after the Civil War. The Cooke insolvency had been preceded by a massive dumping of US stocks and bonds in London and the rest of Europe. This was London's way of shutting down the Civil War boom that Lincoln's dirigist and protectionist policies had made possible. Instead, a long US depression followed.

* The Panic of 1893 was prepared by the 1890 "Baring panic" in London, caused by the insolvency of Barings Bank, the same one which went bankrupt and was sold off in the spring of 1995. In the resulting depression, the US Treasury surplus was reduced to almost nothing, and a budget defecit loomed. Using this situation as a pretext, British speculators drove the exchange rate of the dollar down to the point where owners of gold began exporting their gold to London. Treasury gold stocks dipped below $100,000,000, and then kept falling to $68,000,000; US national bankruptcy threatened. In response to this crisis, subversive President Grover Cleveland gave control of the US public debt to the New York banking houses of Morgan and Belmont, themselves British agents of influence. Cleveland "sold out to Wall Street" by selling US gold bonds to Morgan and Belmont at reduced prices, with the taxpayers picking up the tab; Morgan and Belmont promised to "use their influence" in London to prevent further British bear raids against the US dollar and gold stocks. All of this caused another long depression.......




Hoover-Ville's dissapeared shortly after Roosevelt took office - as did the banking collapse, bank panics/runs, ferocious deflation resulting in horrible austerity and unemployment.

You can disagree with some of FDR's policy but to call what he did a "Scheme" is just beyond absurd... entering the area of completely ludicrous.

-Revolt 426




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